Re: Direct experience

topic posted Sun, February 10, 2008 - 12:09 AM by 
Here's an exercise that can be fun.

If God didn't make the world who did?

Was it just one person, or maybe two?

If it was two, what does the condition of the world say about their relationship?

or, who put the sharks in the bathtub?.............
posted by:
  • Re: Direct experience

    Sun, February 10, 2008 - 12:42 PM
    How about this, some of us chose to be the sharks in the tank.
    • Re: Direct experience

      Sun, February 10, 2008 - 3:51 PM
      That's funny..... :)

      Why would anyone choose sharkness........ arrrgghhh.....
      • Re: Direct experience

        Sun, February 10, 2008 - 7:32 PM
        Go Teal ! :-)

        (for the uninitiated, that's the San Jose Sharks hockey--
        and some indeed do live near the shark tank)

        I was going to ask what sharks? All "sharkiness"
        is unreal according to the definition given in the text
        of real.
        • Re: Direct experience

          Mon, February 11, 2008 - 6:47 AM
          It's funny how much effort goes into protecting against the "unreal" and talking about the "unreal".
          Going to see the "unreal" on a Saturday night.
          Avoiding the "unreal", by saying it's unreal, when you definitely behave as if it's real.

          Reality is certainly a conversation in the Course, but theres a difference between discussing that ,
          and pretending sharks, "what sharks", don't exist while behaving as if they do.

          Season tickets?

          The post is only meant to be an exercise in imagination, using a background of study in the Course in Miracles and similar material to light up possible scenarios for dealing with life as we find it, in the hope of discovering a way to get through it with some measure of grace.
          Meeting sharks in the ocean, or bears in the woods, or bee's in the bonnet is an experience.
          Wondering about it and using my imagination to consider how it came to be, is more fun than intellectualizing about it's existence when everyday our experience tells us that we need to respond to life somehow. Try telling the folks you meet today that they're not real and see how that works for ya.
          • Re: Direct experience

            Mon, February 11, 2008 - 9:38 AM
            I believe it was the great Tibetan master
            Jamgon Mipham who said that telling
            people (when they are suffering) that their
            suffering is empty just makes them mad.

            Well, its true! And if they get mad, that's their
            business. Sure. I'm the first person to agree
            that in ACIM and other metaphysical and mystical
            paths there's far too much information and not enough
            understanding; too much word processing and
            and not enough thought processing. So sometimes
            its honestly compassionate to be blunt with the truth;
            other times it's kind to let it be and maybe help the person
            consider that there might be other ways of experiencing
            what they are experiencing. But in my opinion, it does people
            no good to let them wallow in it. Of course, practically speaking
            from an ACIM point of view all action (healing action) is guided
            by the HS or an inner light of love.

            I'd never invite people to pretend that what they are experiencing
            isn't real for them as they experience it, yet ACIM does ask us
            to question our beliefs, assumptions, opinions and expectations
            around our experience. If the scaffolding goes, so does the experience
            because it wasn't real in truth-- it always was just our way of experiencing.
            Pretending is one thing, simulating is another. We practice what we don't
            yet know experientally, loking beyond appearences, trusting the intangible.
            That's what we get from doing the lessons. Eventually it becomes our
            direct experience it is not simulated. Maybe this makes sense?
        • Re: Direct experience

          Mon, February 11, 2008 - 10:52 AM
          ha, but if bitten by a shark, it feels pretty real !! doesn't it ?..
          • Re: Direct experience

            Mon, February 11, 2008 - 11:32 AM
            That's one reason I don't go near them. :-)

            You know there's the famous poem:
            "autobiography in five chapters"
            it's about avoiding suffering.

            But when you are face to face, it makes sense
            to deal appropriately. Maybe it feels so real to
            you because you believe that you're as real
            as sharkey's sharp teeth! :-)
            • Re: Direct experience

              Mon, February 11, 2008 - 11:47 AM
              Imagination, exploration, in light of divine inspiration,..............

              oh shoot that rhymes...... :)

              Well anyway, thanks for keeping the flow of ideas moving, and for your sincerity and playfulness,
              in the face life"s difficult tangles.

              Peace. and please keep the ball rolling......
              I appreciate and enjoy hearing your thoughts and ideas.
          • Re: Direct experience

            Mon, February 11, 2008 - 12:01 PM
            That's an excellent track to follow.....

            I'll bet it hurts like.......@#*%

            So there's the "life" of the body, beauty and tragedy and so forth,
            which is unavoidable...... at least while ya got one,
            and the condition of spirit.........

            can the condition of spirit maybe ease the experience of life in the body?

            ( I never meant the shark thing to represent anything to do with your name, I just noticed it as I was posting this now, and hope you don't feel like I was being sly or something )

            In case you did, my name is Cliff, if you need to make any metaphors aimed sideways at me.. :)
            • Re: Direct experience

              Mon, February 11, 2008 - 2:43 PM
              haha, no i didn't take it personaly of course...! i am pretty nice shark. although in extreme situations i know i could attack quite well.
              like if someone threathens my life or my kids, i would kill. therefore i would not be a very good student of The Miracle Book.
              or maybe i am wrong? if someone attacks, can i attack back to protect myself?? i hope so!
              • Re: Direct experience

                Mon, February 11, 2008 - 3:49 PM
                maybe the thing to do is start reading lesson 1 today
                then lesson 2 tomorow...

                we'll see how good a student you are.

                As it says: "this is a required course..."

                That doesn't mean these three books, but what underlies
                them is really how to effectively be a human being.
              • Re: Direct experience

                Mon, February 11, 2008 - 7:15 PM

                Lots of ways to answer that Sharka, and it's a good question.
                The Course has a lot to say about life and death....

                To honor the question, I'll give you what I feel is most meaningful to me,
                in my mind and awareness from studying the Course.
                I'll put it in my own words, rather than quote directly from the book, as it helps me a lot to try to articulate what I'm still learning myself.
                As I reach to describe what I'm trying to make a home for inside myself, I can see where I am from how I speak about it.

                It helps me see what I'm still struggling to incorporate, and also what feels clear to me.

                One of the greatest gifts has been a growing certainty that what happens to my body, your body, all our bodies, is different than the condition of spirit as God created me. It's as If God created me perfect, safe, powerful and innocent, and then I made another version of me that is it's opposite. Someone who is in danger, imperfect, and guilty of all kinds of stuff.
                The self I made needs to be defended, has to learn everything, and will die no matter how well I treat it.
                All my "creations", need to be protected from the same things that afflict me. I love them because I made them, but feel completely vulnerable because of their frailty. When threatened, I too will go to war to protect what I love.

                The Course is teaching me, and I'm learning to trust what I'm learning, that what I love deeply is actually safe, cannot be harmed, and is innocent.

                Your supposed to protect what you love, no question about it, and protecting your body and family and everything you love is essential to your own well being. It's just a question of what constitutes the best protection, the very best, the sure thing, like no kidding, so that what I love is safe, and I'll give my life to make sure of it, if that's what it takes.

                We can't stop things like death and injury from happening to our bodies, or those of our families. We can however choose what the truth about them really is. If we choose, with the guidance of the Holy Spirit, to see them differently, to identify them differently, we can discover a way to live with what happens to our bodies and theirs without love and what we love, ever being threatened or harmed. We can relax the well meant vigilance with which we guard them, and in it's place expand the love we already have for them.

                Sorry if I went on to long. When I understand it better I'll be maybe I'll be able to say it really well in a few lines of brilliant prose!,
                (but don't hold your breath....................... cause I've got a long ways to go) :)
                • Re: Direct experience

                  Mon, February 11, 2008 - 10:48 PM
                  CG

                  There's certainly nothing wrong with what you've written.
                  I agree that paraphrasing is best, because ACIM is not a
                  religion or an aternate bible with all the correct beliefs that
                  one simply learns like information.

                  Back in the 80's Jack and Layle Luckett (the most amazing
                  ACIM teachers) presented it to me this way. "Just take the
                  medicine." What they further explained is that the lessons
                  themselves are the course. We experiement with trying on
                  the ideas contained in them. It's the lab course where you
                  apply the principles. The text is like the big brochure that comes
                  with the pill bottle. it describes the disease, what the medicine
                  does, how it works, what its chemistry is, etc. You might like to
                  know those things but the actual treatment is the lessons.

                  So as a mystical and metaphysical path, ACIM will produce
                  specific measurable changes and result in your life just by
                  practicing the daily lessons. Actually I invite people to go to
                  the teacher's manual as a secondary resource to lessons
                  before going to the text. One reason is that the manual is pure
                  poetry and not as heady or intellectual.

                  Then we have forums like this and our local study groups
                  to explore the implications of what we're experiencing
                  in our "journey without distance" away from ego and into love.
                  Keep the conversation alive.
                • Re: Direct experience

                  Tue, February 12, 2008 - 1:48 PM
                  I like what you wrote CG. Especially in this paragraph. I think you said it well.

                  >>We can't stop things like death and injury from happening to our bodies, or those of our families. We can however choose what the truth about them really is. If we choose, with the guidance of the Holy Spirit, to see them differently, to identify them differently, we can discover a way to live with what happens to our bodies and theirs without love and what we love, ever being threatened or harmed. We can relax the well meant vigilance with which we guard them, and in it's place expand the love we already have for them.
                  <<
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Direct experience

                    Tue, February 12, 2008 - 9:00 PM
                    thanks Christie,
                    It's silly, but I thought your picture was of a chain, (before I ever looked at your profile) :)
                    I was thinking of all these metaphors for the chain in spiritual life, you know, the great chain of being, the ancestral chain linking us to each other and into antiquity........... I was thinking it was really cool as an image, and minimalist ,and sort of east coast.........

                    Then I see it's a flying you! Now that's very cool......... I can really run with that, flying people.... oh yeah, that'll occupy me for days.

                    "When seeing with the awareness of light, with the awareness of the Holy Spirit, and having the willingness to let the Holy Spirit use our abilities to make miracles possible for others, miracles do happen."

                    That's beautiful Christie. Cheers...
                    • Re: Direct experience

                      Tue, February 12, 2008 - 10:48 PM
                      That's so cool that you saw my icon that way. It reminds me of songs, or poetry. Like how songs can be interpreted in different ways. The best songs are ones that have lyrics that shed light in different ways to different people. I especially like songs in which I thought the lyrics were saying something different than what I later learned they were, but that my idea of what the lyrics were meant something beautiful, perhaps even profound.

                      I like your interpretations of the chain. :-)
                      • Re: Direct experience

                        Wed, February 13, 2008 - 12:07 AM

                        "The best songs are ones that have lyrics that shed light in different ways"

                        she weaves secrets in her hair
                        she's deep as a whale

                        another day wastes away
                        and my heart sinks with the sun

                        a new day is dawning
                        and a new day has not yet begun

                        so anyway
                        there I was
                        just sittin on your poarch

                        drinking in
                        the sweetest decline

                        what's the use in regret
                        theirs just things
                        we haven't done yet

                        what I regret
                        is just lessons
                        we haven't learned yet

                        another day draws away
                        and
                        my heart sinks with the sun

                        it's like catching snow on my tongue

                        you can't pin this butterfly down.................

                        Beth Orton
                        The Sweetest Decline, from the CD Central Reservation....

                        your turn :)
                        • Re: Direct experience

                          Sun, February 17, 2008 - 1:01 PM
                          That's a beautiful song.

                          Here's my example of songs that can have more than one meaning. These two songs were usually played back to back at Grateful Dead concerts.

                          "Scarlet Begonias"
                          words by Robert Hunter; music by Jerry Garcia

                          As I was walkin' round Grosvenor Square
                          Not a chill to the winter
                          but a nip to the air
                          From the other direction
                          she was calling my eye
                          It could be an illusion
                          but I might as well try
                          Might as well try.

                          She had rings on her fingers and
                          bells on her shoes,
                          And I knew without askin' she was
                          into the blues
                          Scarlet begonias
                          tucked into her curls
                          I knew right away
                          she was not like other girls--
                          other girls

                          In the thick of the evening
                          when the dealing got rough
                          She was too pat to open and
                          too cool to bluff
                          As I picked up my matches and
                          was closing the door
                          I had one of those flashes:
                          I'd been there before--
                          been there before.

                          [Bridge]
                          I ain't often right
                          but I've never been wrong
                          It seldom turns out the way
                          it does in the song
                          Once in a while
                          you get shown the light
                          in the strangest of places
                          if you look at it right

                          Well there ain't nothin' wrong
                          with the way she moves
                          Or scarlet begonias or a
                          touch of the blues
                          And there's nothing wrong with
                          the love that's in her eye
                          I had to learn the hard way
                          to let her pass by--
                          let her pass by

                          The wind in the willows played Tea for Two
                          The sky was yellow and the sun was blue
                          Strangers stopped strangers
                          just to shake their hand
                          Everybody's playing
                          in the Heart of Gold Band
                          Heart of Gold Band


                          "Fire On the Mountain"
                          Words by Robert Hunter; music by Mickey Hart

                          Long distance runner what you standing there for?
                          Get up, get off, get out of the door
                          You're playing cold music on the bar room floor,
                          drowned in your laughter and dead to the core
                          There's a dragon with matches loose on the town
                          Take a whole pail of water just to cool him down

                          Fire - Fire On the Mountain
                          Fire - Fire on the mountain

                          Almost aflame still you don't feel the heat
                          Takes all you got just to stay on the beat
                          You say it's a living, we all gotta eat
                          but you're here alone there's no one to compete
                          If mercy's in business I wish it for you
                          More than just ashes when your dreams come true

                          Fire - Fire on the mountain
                          Fire - Fire on the mountain

                          Long distance runner what you holdin out for?
                          Caught in slow motion in your dash to the door
                          The flame from your stage has now spread to the floor
                          You gave all you got, why you wanta give more?
                          The more that you give, why, the more it will take
                          to the thin line beyond which you really cannot fake

                          There's a fire
                          Fire on the mountain


                          Anyone else have one?

Recent topics in "A Course In Miracles"

Topic Author Replies Last Post
A Course In Miracles in a digital Notebook format Crystal Pete 0 July 31, 2008
Any miracles lately anyone? Sharka 3 July 26, 2008
Holy Spirit Cathy 20 July 24, 2008
DOU Maestro 4 July 6, 2008